‘I wouldn’t like anyone looking down on Cavan as a GAA county, thinking we are inferior…’

Interview

New Cavan senior football manager Dermot McCabe has been busy assembling a panel and putting plans in place for the new season. PAUL FITZPATRICK sat down with him to find out more.

How are you settling into the job?

The first part of it, I suppose, when I was fortunate enough to get the position is that you should tidy up your backroom team and get your supports in place. From my experience, it’s critical that you have a medical team in position. A lot of lads are coming in from club championships, and maybe from the year entirely, with little niggles and knocks. Your first aim is to try and clear up those and see where they are at in relation to that.

So we’ve just been doing screening and testing as regards the lads and how they’ve got through the club championship in order to prep them for our pre -season training.

I suppose you probably have a few of your panel playing in Ulster...

I have some of my backroom team that are still playing in Ulster and I don’t mind a winning mentality around it as much as possible. Diarmuid (Scullion) is involved with Scotstown who are progressing in Ulster. One of my physios is involved with Leitrim Gaels who have progressed for the first time. I like that, it’s possible for that winning mentality to seep into any angle of the dressing room is good for me, so I’d be hoping that Munterconnaught continue their run, and Cuchulainns and Kingscourt get a run in Ulster (interview took place prior to Kingscourt’s defeat). You know, there is the thought process, but they’ll be playing at a high level, they’ll be competing at a high level, and hopefully the players that I’m talking about using won’t pick up any major injuries or niggles, and I think it’s good for the county and it’s good for the panel.

Was it always an ambition of yours to manage Cavan?

It’s probably not something that I sort of wrote down on paper to say that I wanted to do or would like to do. I started with the minors pretty much direct out of playing, Tom Reilly as chairman approached me about getting involved in that and I suppose the work and the coaching that I would be doing now would be drastically different than what I was doing then.

And I suppose that gave me an appetite to try and work with players and sort of improve teams as a whole. So I really enjoy setting up coaching set-ups, game scenarios, that type of situation to, I would like to think, improve players or give them a little bit more confidence that we have something in place for most of the scenarios we meet.

So it will be more the enjoyment of that and I suppose the higher level of player you can work with, is more enjoyable. So definitely to get involved with Cavan is a massive honour. I would be very much besotted with Cavan in that I was fortunate that I came straight out of minor at 18 years of age, in October I got the opportunity to play with Cavan and played for 10 plus - or too many years maybe some might say (laughs).

But it was probably the be-all and end-all and to now get the opportunity to manage is fantastic and I’m really looking forward to it.

Would you have grown up in one of those families that would have gone to Cavan games all the time?

Yeah, I suppose. I’m the youngest of eight so there was a lot of us and we would be sort of football fanatics in our family. I suppose the eldest, Martin, might have been driving to the games so I was fortunate enough that we might have gone to Leinster Club, Connacht Club, any club championship games that were on this time of year.

We could end up going anywhere and I’d try and get jumping into the back of the car to get going watching that match. So, you know, GAA would be massive for me and would be major. So, yeah, it’s a huge opportunity.

Maybe you have already answered this but what part are you most looking forward to?

Yeah, I like that (analysis and tactics). Yes, there’s individual brilliance and hopefully that’ll get us through some scenarios but I don’t think that individual has to work all the time to get that score or that individual defender should be always left one-on-one so what I find intriguing is trying to find as a group how we create that score.

And probably the run off the ball for that forward to kick that score is the bit that interests me a lot - or the defensive shape, our defensive structure in terms how we do it as a group would probably interest me. The challenge of getting that across to players, the challenge of us looking and working as a collective and seeing those things then happen on the field and the players enjoying doing it is a huge positive for me.

You’ve said before if your attacking shape is right, it should look after other areas of the field. What would be your over-riding philosophy as a coach?

I suppose, I don’t consider myself to be a defensive coach. I would feel that if you have good attacking shape, your defensive shape should be okay. In our training sessions, we will try and set up various scenarios that we should be seeing throughout the year and then how we’d work collectively to break those down, be it in an attacking manner or a defensive manner.

And that’s the way that we would lay out a lot of our training sessions. My expectation of any lad lucky enough to get a Cavan jersey is that desire, intensity, ambition should be an automatic If it’s not an automatic, then they’re going to have difficulties, whereas we’re working collectively to try and do things better on the field.

What things would you have learned from the year in Westmeath? Was there anything that surprised you?

I suppose I would have felt that I probably needed to gain more experience. And if I ever had aspirations to take Cavan, this was a huge stepping stone. I had decided that I had been a number of years in Gowna and it was potentially time for them to hear a new voice and to step away. We had aspirations or hopes at that time maybe to progress in Ulster and that hadn’t happened.

So I sort of said, maybe a new voice is needed. I then got a call out of the blue to speak to Westmeath and, I suppose, it was a massive challenge and to take on that opportunity. I said, well, look, I might as well test myself here. I suppose to be losing 10 or 12 players off the panel was a massive hit initially. But once we grinded down and we got through, we became a very competitive team.

A lot of debuts were made throughout the year. And nobody within the group used that as an excuse. We were all devastated when we lost a game. But what I would have felt was the collectiveness, the competitiveness… If you have that, you can battle in any game and you can compete with anyone in any situation. And hopefully that will be an assistance to me in making sure Cavan get over the line in each game.

Looking at Cavan, I don’t want to ask you to comment on previous managers because it wouldn’t be fair, but why do you think we as a football-mad county have enjoyed such sporadic success going back through the last four or five decades?

I would say, probably collectively, and probably since I was a player, I would think maybe Cavan don’t look at themselves in a positive manner. I would think that, ‘oh, geez, we’re playing them’ would be the approach, or just, ‘I don’t know if we’ll be able to beat them’, whereas I would think a lot of counties that maybe I would feel we’re stronger than don’t have those thoughts and notions.

I think Cavan have a huge football tradition. We won’t be going through the history, but we’ll be trying to build in here that we’ve covered a lot of this stuff. We’ll have covered it. We’ll be in physically good condition, and we’ll be competitive people. And there’s no reason why we can’t compete against anyone.

I’m not talking about psychology (but) it’s more a mental thing, we sit into this sort of tradition, of this is where we’re at, and we let others dictate to us. I wouldn’t believe that we are that, I would feel we have very strong players. We have very good facilities, and we need to compete as strongly as we can.

You made the point a couple of times that people were coming up to you wishing you good luck and a couple of people smartly said they thought you were going to need it.

They didn’t mean it like that. I was overwhelmed with the amount of messages, from people I know and didn’t know. I would still go to a couple of underage games with my young lads and lassies playing and a lot of people would come up to you and wish you the best of luck and some people would say ‘you’ll need it all’.

They didn’t mean any badness by that, but it’s just that is the mentality or the thought process that’s out there. I don’t think that I need luck with the players we have here. And that’s where maybe I’m naive or maybe I’m foolish (but) I just think Cavan have lots of strong players and lots of capable players, we just need to believe that and work extremely hard.

And would that bug you personally?

I wouldn’t like anyone looking down on Cavan as a GAA county. I wouldn’t like anyone looking down to think that we are inferior or an inferior team. Now results can go against you and all that type of stuff. But I would like to think the Cavan supporters are great supporters. And I would like to think that they’ll see a very competitive team that’ll be working extremely hard and they’ll support that.

And results, I suppose, with conditions etc etc can go different ways. But I think if the supporters and everyone knows that the players have put the work in and are working extremely hard in the field, they’ll be very happy and contented with that.

So what would success look like under you?

I’m not a person to say that I want to achieve this, that or the other. I’m a competitive person and I want to win a lot of things. You need to be in the top 10 teams in Ireland if you want to compete. Do I set milestones and targets of probably winning Division 2 and winning Ulster? I probably don’t, in that, let’s take it each stage at a time.

I like to break down in the game. I’m into analysis. I don’t bore the players on it but we would have metrics and things we need to achieve in each game, regardless of the team we play. And I would feel if we’re meeting those measures we’ll beat a lot of teams, that’s the aim.

Without naming names, unless you want to, are we going to see four or five more new players in on the Cavan team in 2026?

No, I won’t name names, but my expectation is, look, there’s a lot of people that have given a lot of service. I’ve started to talk to some of the players and they’re very eager, and there’s some still making a few decisions in relation to that.

You know, depending on what way you look and depending where county football is for you, it can be perceived as a challenge or as time-consuming. But I would think a lot of players are looking after themselves, are doing a lot of preparation in gym and in field. And maybe this is more co-ordinated and a little bit more structured. And if you enjoy playing football and enjoy the competitiveness of it, I don’t think it’s any more demanding than it ever was in relation to that type of work.

I’m not a person for four-hour sessions and all that type of stuff. It’s in, this is what we want to learn from this session, this is what we’ll work hard on doing, and we’re out when we’re finished the session. And hopefully we see that on the field then the following day or following week.

And in terms of your relationship with players that you have managed, I suppose every player is different, but what would be your philosophy towards relating to lads?

Well, I would like to discuss, you know, various scenarios. While it might be perceived different, I’m not that headstrong, ‘this is the way we’re doing it and this is it’. If there’s a discussion to be had and there’s a better agreement, then that’s the decision we would make as regards to the way we’re playing.

But I would do quite a lot of research into what way I feel is beneficial to us and maybe can negate the opposition and I would probably look to sell or show the players exactly the reasons why we came to the decisions we came to and hopefully they see fruition on that and would ask questions along the way.

And then in terms of the U20s, would you be hands-on or how much time can you give to them?

I wouldn’t look at a person’s age, I feel if they’re 18 or 38, you know, if they’re a person doing the work and putting their hands up… I would think that the (relationship between) the U20 and the senior manager, and I’ve talked to Chris (Conroy) a few times since his appointment, is critical in who puts up their hand (for selection).

Would I have said when I was 18 years of age and got an opportunity that I’d have got to play three years of U21 and three years of senior, competing in a number of Ulster finals in those years? No, I probably wouldn’t but I got lucky breaks along the way and it happened.

So I’m not saying that I’m going to be playing a number of U20s but I think if we have a full-back and he’s being exposed to marking the likes of a Paddy Lynch or a Gearoid McKiernan, or a midfielder on someone else, I think that’ll only help that 18-year-old for his progression. And when he comes back and plays in the U20s, he will be in better shape to handle whatever full-forward comes his way. That would be my mentality. My hope along the way is that some of those players put up their hands and show huge determination and maybe get an opportunity to play at senior level.

Do you think it has been a bit overblown, we are nearly conditioned to think that a lad of 19 is far too young to be playing senior?

Yeah, well I would say we’re the only sport in Ireland (with that mindset). If you were to look at rugby, we have 18-year-olds that play for their club, that play international rugby, and perhaps some that play with the Lions. But yet, it’s sort of thought here that a 19-year-old can’t play senior inter -county football.

Maybe I can be corrected on this, but I would say the GAA are the only people that would think that that’s a (valid) notion or that’s an idea.

I would say every other sport says that if a player’s good enough, it doesn’t matter what age he is. You’re seeing 16-year-olds playing in the Premier League, if a 19-year-old is good enough, he should be playing.

That’s my thoughts on it.

You mentioned on the interview you did with Paddy Sheanon that there’s a perception out there of you that is not accurate. Is that something that has bugged you?

No, it doesn’t bug me really. I just put my head down and I work hard and would like to think that anyone that gets to work with me or gets to know me knows that I work hard and that I’m very passionate about Cavan and I want Cavan to do extremely well. And if they’re not doing extremely well, no-one will have to come and visit and talk to me.

I would have said, whether it’s my biggest asset or whether it’s my worst asset, my biggest critic is me, and was as a player and was in coaching, in that if we suffer something there, I would look at myself first as regards what could we have done better or what could we have done different in relation to our preparation. And I will continue to do that.

Do you miss playing? Or are you over that now?

I’m over that now (laughs). I finished up probably quite young, I suppose 32 years of age. I had a lot of trouble with the knee towards the end and I played a friendly, I remember, out in Gowna, and I did a good bit of harm... I had a few surgeries, and there was talk about having another surgery and at that time, I didn’t have the heart for it, for another recovery programme and all that type of stuff, so I didn’t complete it.

Maybe three or four years later, if I had been asked again, maybe I should have done it, but that’s a long time ago now.

I’ve heard it said that you were intent on keeping a smaller, tighter panel than we’ve seen all the years, is that accurate?

I want everyone to feel that they have an opportunity to play on Sunday. I want that our trainings are competitive. I want everything to be competitive in how we do our work, how we do our work in the gym… and I want competitive people.

I don’t want someone that’s happy to be on a county panel and getting number 25, not that I think we have any of those players.

If there is potential for injuries, which there is, I know Chris is talking about having a slightly bigger panel.

And therefore, if we needed players, or additional players, that we would maybe gain access to them for the occasional training session to give them the opportunity.

So my preference would be, you know, 32 rather than 42 of a panel, so everyone feels they have an opportunity.

When you went for the job, I think it’s well documented now that some of the players wanted you to take over as a manager and they approached you. To that point, were you considering it or did that tilt you towards it?

I suppose, over the years I’ve given a lot of time to Cavan. I suppose the expectation was the opportunity wasn’t going to arise for this year in that I think the last management had another year left on their term and when the decision came up, I suppose a number of players did come to talk.

I had a family holiday for a few weeks around that time and myself, my wife and the kids sort of made a decision that there can be good and bad with this, there can be negatives and positives.

And we sort of agreed that it was something that I was very passionate about and something that I’d be very honoured to put my name forward to.

And once we had that discussion over the holiday, I was going home to try and get the position or get the job.